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 Post subject: Mr. Gore and Global Warming
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 5:36 am 
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I searched for either a thread on Mr. Gore or Global Warming but couldn't find one. So here we go...

We know people like Mr. Gore and other liberals are convinced that the world is heating up and that this is directly caused by human activity.

I believe that the world is heating up, though maybe not enough to worry about, but there is no clear correlation between the burning of fossil fuels and this warming.

Al Gore has taken it upon himself to be a prophet for global warming. He's spent the past few years running around the country giving speeches on how the end is near and how Americans need to start conserving and changing their energy habits or we'll all freeze and/or burn to death in the future. His documentary, An Inconvenient Truth, won an Oscar last week.

Yet, Mr. Gore doesn't seem to practice what he preaches. A recent report shows that Gore's "footprint" is 20 times larger than the average American's.

Good times, Al. Keep on, keepin' on.

EDIT: Found this funny blog entry with some more facts about Mr. Gore.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 5:54 am 
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Al Gore's solutions seem more like, "Blah, blah, blah, just throw money at it! Caring about the Earth is fashionable and lucrative! Let's mass-produce more things like DVDs to only encourage our world-wide problems of industrial waste! I don't really seem to care that recycling plants expend more resources than they save, either!" than anything else. If Al Gore really was true environmentalist, he'd make a film narrated by the Unabomber Manifesto, don a ski mask and pull off some ALF/ELF terrorism before running away to the jungles and living with South American rainforest natives who've found a sustainable niche with their surroundings. Otherwise, I'm not very impressed and moved by all his ranting. Just merely participating in modern society makes you have a negative impact on the Earth, and so what's he supposed to prove by flying around in a private jet and owning a mansion, and showing up to decadent Hollywood functions?


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:02 am 
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Ohh c'mon, you can't help but love the guy! He created the internets, as well as part of Mecha-Hitlers arm!

But seriously, Gore is a good guy; he's funny, he's smart, and he laughs at himself. He calls himself the "Former Future President."
He should run for president again in '08, he might win, might not, but still.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:08 am 
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Jello Biafra should be nominated for president again (he would have been a Green party candidate, but the better-known Ralph Nader was of course chosen over him). His 2000 platform was awesome:

Quote:
I am surprised and honored to be drafted as a nominee. I have been an artist/activist since 1978. I was the leader and creative force of pioneering punk band Dead Kennedys. I have owned and operated a small business, Alternative Tentacles Records. We are now celebrating our twentieth anniversary.

I ran for Mayor of San Francisco in 1979, placing fourth out of 10 candidates. I was the main target in the first criminal trial over a record album in American history. The jury deadlocked and the charges were dismissed. This vaulted me into the national media and lecture circuit as a spokesman on civil liberties. I have locked horns with Tipper Gore, Pat Buchanan, Oprah Winfrey, and many Religious Right activists on this issue.

Besides music, I have released five spoken word CD sets that boil down and promote many ideas dear to Greens: human rights, freedom of speech, the Gulf War, the Drug War/Prison-Industrial Complex, globalization and the WTO, and a newer emphasis on how to fight back.

I have been registered Green for many years, and support the Green Key Values and Platform. But how do we implement and sell (Yes, sell. This is Disney-addled America) our key values and programs to the general public?

A few ideas:
Enact a maximum wage. Great idea. When I got it aired on Politically Incorrect I was roundly booed by audience and guests alike. The host told the viewers I was crazy before he even said my name. People assume they are the ones who will be hurt when the big bad government hits the middle class with another evil tax.

So let’s be generous: No taxes up to $100,000; after that it’s payback time. And emphasize the pay-back—free health care, free education (including amnesty on student loans), free transportation (including air travel), and more.

Revenue will be used for the many costly programs in the Green platform and long overdue public works projects; also vastly increased subsidies for the arts, especially community radio and television; subsidies for independent organic farms, hemp and kenaf farms (to end dependence on paper from forests), and solar and windmill farms to decrease our fossil fuel gluttony.

Urban blight can be further eradicated by legalizing and subsidizing squatters who fix up long-vacant buildings. This has worked well in Europe when given a chance; think of what it could do for places like St. Louis or Richmond, Va. Speed up conversion to electric buses, trucks, a national high-speed rail system; and ,of course, electric cars.

We don’t need a flat tax, but a flattening tax, to truly level the playing field. After all, what causes more damage to the planet, drug addiction or wealth addiction? Hopefully the maximum wage will raise enough money to fill the cups of everyone who makes less than $100,000 so we’ll all be even. And can we please find a clearer, sexier term than 'single-payer health care' next time it’s a ballot initiative?

We must close all hemorrhaging tax loopholes that benefit giant corporations, including organized religion.

Taxpayers should also be given a multiple choice of the 10 or 15 major areas of government to decide what percentage of their tax money goes where. My guess is that education and the environment will go straight up, and the arms race and prison expansion will go straight down.

Abolish the Military. And the CIA, NSA, DIA, DEA, ATF, hopefully the FBI, and disband all SWAT teams. Our biggest national security threat is the environmental destruction of our planet and the arms race. So let’s use the defense budget, personnel, and know-how for a new mission: clean up toxic waste, rebuild cities and infrastructure, dismantle all nuclear arms and satellites, and implement worldwide the very environmental and labor practices Third World WTO delegates complained are too costly.

Withdraw from NAFTA and the World Trade Organization. Wealth addicts have gotten carried away; now it’s time for rehab. Earlier in our history there were strict laws mandating public hearings and revocations of charters of corporations for misconduct, and restricting directorships to one corporation per person. Let’s bring these laws back.

Irradiated and GM (Genetically Mutilated) frankenfood and other products must be labeled. The Telecommunications Act of 1996 should be repealed immediately. And workers should be allowed to elect their bosses.

End the war on drugs. Decriminalize marijuana and illegal narcotics such as heroin, cocaine, and crack. Hard-core addiction is an illness, not a crime. Put users on prescription, and crime will drop dramatically when they don’t have to rob and kill people to pay the Mob’s high drug prices. Any president or governor can stop the prison-building boom right now by commuting sentences for minor, non-violent drug offenders to time served. Why not pressure them to do it?

The same goes for the death penalty. I have chosen Mumia Abu-Jamal, a noted author, journalist, and activist currently on Death Row in Pennsylvania on questionable charges, as my vice presidential running mate to show why we should join the rest of the civilized world and halt executions forever.

I am an anarchist in my personal life. I try to live my life in a way that I don’t need cops or baby-sitters to keep me from infringing on others. But I don’t feel we have evolved far enough as a species to make anarchy work in society itself. We still need government to transfer the wealth from those who have too much to those who have too little, to make sure important projects get done, and keep territorial humans from screwing over and killing each other.

So guess what? I’m Tough On Crime®, especially when the punishment fits the crime:

Sentence slum lords to live in their own buildings.
Sentence polluters to inhale and swim in the mess they’ve made until they clean it up.
Sentence Savings and Loan sharks and white collar gangstas from our recent bank deregulation to pay back all the money they steal, just like if they held up a 7-11.
Sentence arms dealers and manufacturers to pay for rebuilding all the places destroyed by the wars they help start.
End Police Brutality. Make police officers stand for election every four years, voted on by the districts they patrol.

Lower the Voting Age to Five. See youth apathy magically turn around when they know they have a real stake in their future; and get to vote for their school boards, and why not their teachers?

Education Reform. Include a mandatory class on parenting and offer drug and sex education using actual drugs and sex in class. Showing how it’s done with an emphasis on sensitivity could do wonders for combating sexism and date rape. Joycelyn Elders is right: teaching masturbation is far more realistic than expecting today’s libidinous teens to bury their heads in abstinence.

Meanwhile, nothing gets bigger laughs at parties than our rigid Drug Czar’s TV ads. To put it mildly: they don’t work. Students should be able to experiment with drugs in a supervised and controlled setting to learn their limits, not sent blindly off on their own into the risks of hard core addiction.

Election Reform. State and national legislative elections should be switched to a parliamentary system with proportional representation. Campaign time should be limited to six weeks. Anyone campaigning or soliciting bribes, excuse me, contributions, beforehand will be automatically disqualified. Ballots in all elections should include the option of voting None of the Above. If NOTA gets over 50% of the vote, a new election must be held with all new candidates.





I apologize to those who feel I should wage a more aggressive campaign. I did not expect to be nominated, and I am locked in my own battle against globalization that has been a huge strain on my time, emotions, and resources. Former members of my old band are suing me with the expressed intent of wiping out 22 years of work because I wouldn’t allow them to put one of our best known songs in a Levi’s Dockers TV commercial. Trial begins April 17.

Plus, I voted for Ralph Nader last time, and would gladly vote for him again. Should I have let my name be on the ballot at all? Ever since I ran for mayor, I have proven to be an effective media magnet and lightning rod for protest votes reaching far beyond the underground popularity of my work. On the other hand, should a flamboyant artist and prankster be the main banner-carrier at this point? Or would more progress be made by only running "serious" candidates?

Events in Seattle and around the globe show there are far more people on our side of the fence than we give credit for. What does it say about our country when people are so desperate for an alternative to our one-party state masquerading as a two-party state that they’ll even elect a professional wrestler governor?

In my own small way I try to inspire people to at least start thinking about what they might do and where they would fit in if we actually found ourselves in charge. For all their faults, at least the front line opposition in places like the Czech Republic and South Africa had some idea of how they would actually run things if and when they had the chance. We’re not there yet. Splitting into two competing Green Parties is just plain childish.



Don’t hate the media, become the media. Film-maker Michael Moore is right: we must spend less time arguing and agreeing with each other, and more time reaching out to people who may not appear to agree with us, but often share the same underlying concerns. These issues aren’t left versus right, they are the top against the bottom. No one who is down-sized out of a job should be allowed to fall for Pat Buchanan. Putting food on the table is the number one wedge issue of growing concern for everyone.

We need to show the step by step ways each individual can help free themselves from Corporate Feudalism. Condensing and translating the Green Party Platform from lawyerese into English, Español, etc. would be a big help here.

We must emphasize the importance of voting in local elections, where a smaller group of concerned citizens can make the most difference. Some people not yet weaned from today’s Democratic Party will try to intimidate us, calling us spoilers who siphon away votes, and tip close races to Republicans. I say, "Great!" Let’s do it some more. The real spoilers are operatives like Clinton, Gore, and the Democratic Leadership Council, rendering their party indistinguishable from the party of Bu$h, Inc., and thus making the Greens, New Party, and others necessary in the first place.

Imagine what we can do if we gain enough seats in legislatures to influence the balance of power. Imagine what we can do if we get the necessary 5 percent of the vote in this presidential election to gain federal matching funds for 2004. This is all more than possible, even under current election laws.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:12 am 
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Jello B?

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:43 am 
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Didymus wrote:
Jello B?

He said somewhere that he made his name before he found out there was a dude named Jello Biafra.

Some of the point Biafra made in that quote seem kind of reasonable...

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:31 pm 
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Well, the Earth is indeed warming up, but partially that is because the Earth is still coming off of it's ice age. But the speed of its warming up is greater than it's supposed to be. Do I believe that there is a connection between global warming and the burning of fossil fuels? Yes.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:26 pm 
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Do I think there's a connection? Yes.
Do I think the connection is big enough to not be offset by some of the other things that happen when you put greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere (like increasing particulates that increase the reflectivity of the earth's atmosphere)? I don't know.
Do I think that we're going to catastrophically alter earth's climate? No.
Do I think it's the biggest problem affecting humanity? No.

Between religious extremism, nuclear proliferation, pop punk bands, and corruption in the highest levels of governments, I think there are more important things to worry about.

Why do I feel the way I do about Global Warming? I knew enough about climatology to not be brainwashed by Al Gore. I've taken climatology classes, applied climatology classes, and I've read a small forest worth of papers on the subject (papers in AMS and AGU Journals, not rags like Nature).

While I don't recommend that you only read papers by one person, a good place to start would be with a Google Scholar search for John R Christy (I certainly hope Bazooka Joe will have read some of these by the time he graduates). Dr. Christy is pretty well respected in the community. He's constructed one of the more trusted data sets on planetary temperatures over the last 30 or so years. He's also not making claims that are "sort of" supported by the data. He looks at the data and says what the data says.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 7:43 pm 
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But seriously, Gore is a good guy; he's funny, he's smart, and he laughs at himself. He calls himself the "Former Future President."
He should run for president again in '08, he might win, might not, but still.


You realize that his own home state didn't vote for him in 2000, right? If he'd managed to get the vote of Tennessee, the entire Florida thing wouldn't have even mattered.

Although now that he's attained rock star status with the young people and Hollywood crowd, maybe he would have a chance to win. Smart man, that Al.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:28 pm 
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StrongRad wrote:
Do I think there's a connection? Yes.
Do I think the connection is big enough to not be offset by some of the other things that happen when you put greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere (like increasing particulates that increase the reflectivity of the earth's atmosphere)? I don't know.
Do I think that we're going to catastrophically alter earth's climate? No.
Do I think it's the biggest problem affecting humanity? No.


My thoughts precisely, with this addendum: Since it is apparent that we ARE affecting the global climate--even if only minutely--I see no reason why we SHOULDN'T do our part to stay environmentally friendly. It may not put a huge dent in the warming process, but it would at least be better than us not changing anything. There ARE positive effects that we've seen since the Clean Air Act of the 70s. For example: my uncle went to the same college I did for a couple years, back in the early 70s. Thge edge of my campus (where the Music building is, where both me and my uncle studied) is located just across a set of railroad tracks from a major refinery. The entire city has many other refineries about as well. My uncle told me that he remembered the great metal letters on the side of the building spelling "MUSIC" had to be replaced every other year due to erroding caused by chemicals in the air, and that women who walked around campus in nylon stockings for too long had them melt away off their legs due to the same chemicals in the air.

This is obviously not an issue anymore for the university, and it's because the government has since regulated the emissions of commercial plants and refineries and the like.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:03 am 
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lahimatoa wrote:
Quote:
But seriously, Gore is a good guy; he's funny, he's smart, and he laughs at himself. He calls himself the "Former Future President."
He should run for president again in '08, he might win, might not, but still.

You realize that his own home state didn't vote for him in 2000, right? If he'd managed to get the vote of Tennessee, the entire Florida thing wouldn't have even mattered.

Well, I think that just came down to the fact that he was a Democrat. And we all know the south barely ever votes Democrat, while the northeast almost always does, and never votes Republican.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:22 am 
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Acekirby wrote:
Well, I think that just came down to the fact that he was a Democrat. And we all know the south barely ever votes Democrat, while the northeast almost always does, and never votes Republican.


Actually, the South used to vote exclusively Democrat, once Lincoln (a Republican) signed the Emancipation Proclomation...though a lot of that changed whenever the Democratic party became the liberal party again...in the 1950s, I think. The South just votes Conservative--be that Democrat or Republican.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 6:25 am 
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It's getting hot outside. You know wehat that means? Time to paint that toast.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 5:13 am 
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Yeah, An Inconvenient Truth was rather propaganda-ish. Yeah, Gore might be a hypocrite. But the thing is, while the estimations may be overblown in An Inconvenient Truth, the message is universal, and you can bicker and bicker about how the film is totally inaccurate - but does it really matter? The whole point of the film is basically a wake up call that says: "Hey! America! Quit being so irrational and stop polluting!" Because regardless of whether or not the oceans are going to flood, I think everyone needs to walk to work or take the bus or wash out their milk cartons and recycle them. So what if he's a pop-culture-icon? I for one would rather have the teenagers of America following a environmentalist than freaking Britney Spears or 50 Cent.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 5:24 am 
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The problem is, he's peddling bad science.
Granted, his message may be on the right track, but he's still taking the wrong freakin' train.

If Global Warming was so important to Gore, it looks like he would have gone to a congressional hearing on global warming that was held on 20 July of 06. Where was Mr Gore (who has often chastised congress for having no vision on warming)? Across the Potomac, in northern VA at a book signing.

Seems like, if he was really concerned about the issue, he would have dropped in and given a listen (and/or a talk).

The Committee Chairman, whose name I can't remember wrote:
Nor will we be hearing from Vice President Gore, who has spoken often of Congress’s and the Administration’s “blinding lack of awareness” about this “planetary emergency” and whose spokesperson told the L.A. Times the Vice President would “go anywhere and talk to any audience that wants to learn about climate change and how to solve it.”
The Committee asked the Vice President to pick any date in June or July, but apparently ours was not one of the “audiences” he had in mind.
While Mr. Waxman and I are disappointed, we understand that movie screenings and book signings are time consuming, and we hope his book signing in Northern Virginia went well yesterday.



teehee...

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 Post subject: Re: Mr. Gore and Global Warming
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:06 pm 
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lahimatoa wrote:
EDIT: Found this funny blog entry with some more facts about Mr. Gore.
I think this was the link you were looking for:
http://iowahawk.typepad.com/iowahawk/20 ... lanet.html

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 1:58 am 
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Gore keeps it up.

Yesterday there were Congressional hearings about global warming and Mr. Gore was asked to participate. As part of these proceedings, Al was reminded of a part from An Inconvenient Truth where he asks America to reduce the amount of energy they consume.

Then he was asked to make a similar pledge. Basically, he was asked to pledge to reduce his "carbon footprint" to that of the average American within one year.

Gore's response?

Nah.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 2:42 am 
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Gore has been criticized for excessive home energy usage at his residence in Tennessee. His electricity usage is reportedly 20 times higher than the average American household.


Wrong, nameless news place. They messed up his bill.

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Wrong, nameless news place. They messed up his bill.


Link?

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 2:54 am 
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lahimatoa wrote:
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Wrong, nameless news place. They messed up his bill.


Link?

That makes 2 of us. As far as I know, I've NEVER heard him refute it, only that he's bought enough "carbon credits" to balance it out.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 4:18 am 
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And most news places have names.

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I'll be truthful. Am I a global warming nut? Yes. Did I get sucked into his propaganda? Yes. Do I think we'll kill everything in the end? Yes. Do I think a lot of people be eradicated to slow down our process? Not anymore. Now, the simple one couple to one child ratio should fix it if enacted worldwide in 10 years or so.

But, thanks to StrongRad's arguement that we're still warming up after our last ice age, I feel soothed. But that still won't make me not nutty about saving electricity. Because it'll help. Recycling will help. Not driving cars will help. Everything we can do to help will, but it's just that too many people think it's impossible, including myself. Which is why I tend to go back and forth on this issue a LOT. I think I made a billion contradictions in this post alone!

I agree that Al Gore has the right idea, but using the wrong methods. But it does work into getting people to be more environmentally aware. And the point of this is the only world we have is a very. Strong. Point. If we do happen to destroy our planet, we're screwed. Basically, the one reason why I think whoever manages to make something that'll break down CO2 to be able to do whatever he pleases for life.

I know I have lots of contradictions and likely false information, but if we go through Technological Revolution ver 2.0, then I can finally sleep on summer nights not thinking about this issue. At least, not artificial causes. Ice age getting-out-of, maybe. But that's natural and I approve.

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Gore is full of crap.

I did a whole project on this for my history class, and the information I gathered is atounding.

First and foremost, Gore hired scientists (respectable, intelligent scientists) to study global warming.

"I'll pay ya' a whole lot more if ya' prove global warming is true."

Well of course, scientists got all information they could find and exagurated it to an extent that we'll all die if nothing changes.

False.

The world is heating up one degree every 100 years. To reiterate, 1 degree every century.

Is this a cause for alarm? I'm not saying this isn't truw, but come on, don't get your panties in a bunch.

... Gore is a waste of time. He tries to tell us that he is enviro-safe, but he drives 14 SUV's and uses as much electicity in a day than you would use in a year.

And that's a fact.

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Some guy I know was just today saying how he thinks Al Gore doesn't even listen to what he says, that he just does it for profit.

Personally, I think it's sincere, but... who knows?

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I'm burned out on the global warming issue. Even if global warming isn't a big deal, it's obvious that environmental destruction (emissions, etc) is.

But having someone telling me what a big deal it is makes me think of someone from management of a company coming to my desk and saying "Hey, we're understaffed. We're understaffed, and that's a problem. It's a big problem! We're understaffed! We're understaffed!" As if telling me over and over, and explaining why it's such a big problem, will fix the problem.

Yes, yes, I know, "grass roots, voters, all the difference" yadda yadda. That argument puts me in mind of this piece from The Onion.

Until the government has the guts to start cutting into what people see as their inalienable right to have a personal waste stream half a mile wide, there won't be much significant change.

. . . That's my pessimistic take, anyway.

On the upside, almost every car company besides Ford is starting to break into the greener-car market, thanks to consumer pressure, which is extra cool.


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-Cyberpumpkin- wrote:
On the upside, almost every car company besides Ford is starting to break into the greener-car market, thanks to consumer pressure, which is extra cool.


More than that, if you check out this site, you could mod your engine to run on nothing but water. Period. (Though, admittedly, to run 100% on water, the mods end up being extremely expensive. It can still be modded to have a significant portion of it run on water for a more moderate amount of moolah.)

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:13 pm 
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PianoManGidley wrote:
-Cyberpumpkin- wrote:
On the upside, almost every car company besides Ford is starting to break into the greener-car market, thanks to consumer pressure, which is extra cool.


More than that, if you check out this site, you could mod your engine to run on nothing but water. Period. (Though, admittedly, to run 100% on water, the mods end up being extremely expensive. It can still be modded to have a significant portion of it run on water for a more moderate amount of moolah.)

Ok, so I have to admit, they're a little more modest than most HHO sites (they don't make the claim that you start with water and end with the same amount of water), so they might be for real. Their conspiracy type claim makes me think they're a bit dubious. ANY auto manufacturer that could get this to work would flood the market with cars that run that way. Nobody would buy ANYTHING from their competition.

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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2007 5:56 am 
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Be honest now, is Al Gore a good guy where the environment is concerned (in spite of his huge footprint) or isn't he? Because I'm trying to recycle more than ever and when and if I get my car, I will try and make sure that it's as fuel-efficient as it comes. I think as a general rule, most Japanese-made compact cars (like Toyota, Nissan or Honda) tend to be efficient in fuel consumption. I will also continue to recycle, too, now more than ever. I've been recycling much of my life, even before I was more conscious of the environment, as I am now.

Anyway, is Al Gore a good guy or just a rabble-rouser?

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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 11:49 am 
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Ethanol is not a good alternative fuel. Ethanol comes from Corn. You have to grow Corn. The more Corn we use, the more places we need to plant it in. Thus leading to an even greater destruction of the rainforest.

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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 12:56 pm 
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sam3611 wrote:
Ethanol is not a good alternative fuel. Ethanol comes from Corn. You have to grow Corn. The more Corn we use, the more places we need to plant it in. Thus leading to an even greater destruction of the rainforest.


How are you coming up with that equation? Who says we'll need more rainforest real estate to grow this corn?

(Not saying you're wrong, I just want to see where you get this info.)


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