Homestar Runner Wiki Forum

We all know Europe has a birth rate of less than 2 and a high immigration rate. The way things are going, the continent will be predominantly Muslim in the next 100 years, if not sooner.

And now, a German court is citing the Koran as basis for a ruling.

A German judge ruled today that a Muslim woman whose husband beat her repeatedly had no right to file charges against him, or appeal to the Court for a quick divorce (Germany makes you wait a year for a divorce to finalize).

The fact that the woman, a German citizen born in Germany to Moroccan parents, was living as a Westerner (I'm assuming that means without a veil/headscarf/etc) was a significant affront to the 'honor' of the husband, and according to that great book of peace, the Koran, he had every right to beat her. So I guess German judges are now applying Sharia law - IN GERMANY to German citizens!

For all you Europeans so concerned about Christian influence in American law, maybe you should start worrying about your own neighbors first.

Bottom line, Europe is finished.

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Wow...I can't help but feel you've got some fallacies in your argument there. For one, while using a religious text in a court of law as grounds for passing judgement IS detestable, the same holds true for ANY religious text, including the Bible.

Slippery slope fallacy is another one I could name on you--just because one outrageous instance of such theocratic-type ruling occurs in one European nation does NOT mean that the entire country is doomed to fall into moral decay, let alone the entire continent. Furthermore, your implied assertion that it's the religion of Islam causing such a "downward spiral" speaks of arrogance par excellence. All religions and philosophies, when led by the wrong people, have the power to do the same, including Christianity (Spanish Inquisition, anyone?).

Also, I know NOTHING of Germany's laws, even though I visited there and studied their general culture and language in high school. For all I know (and please someone tell me how right or wrong I am), Germany could operate on a system of religious freedom seperate from our own wherein they use cultural relativism of religions to settle disputes based in or around such religions, no matter what religion one in Germany follows.

Bottom line from me: Your post sounds too similar to Virgil Goode's fallacious reasoning that basic morality that instills the freedoms we have here in America are exclusive to Christianity.

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The meaning of life is 'bucket.'

FOR PONY!!!

I said nothing about morality in my post.

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You said "Europe is Finished," and based on the content in the post and the story it revolves around, I can only assume you are passing a moral judgement on Europe as a whole based on this isolated incident. Unless you care to elaborate. Why is Europe "finished," in your opinion?

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The meaning of life is 'bucket.'

FOR PONY!!!

Eh. I'll worry about it when I see it happen more often. One case doesnt mean the end of the world. And I dont think that the whole continent becoming muslim within 100 years is really anythin bad either (Even though it probably wont happen.).

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Well, bad assumption on your part.

What I meant was that, seeing the trend Europe is following, I believe that soon they will find themselves under Islamic law. Religious freedom as they know it now will be gone.



Have you already forgotten the Paris riots? There's a dangerous divide between native Europeans and European Muslims, and the Muslims are quickly outnumbering the rest.

I'm not saying I can see the future or anything, but I call things how I see them.

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Do you know how bigoted you sound right now?

Europe is fine.

Your Islam-phobia is getting the better of you. Don't be ignorant, post intelligently, like we know you can.

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Give me a break, BTG. You take shots at me no matter what I say.

When I give a damn what you think, I'll let you know.

As it stands, you just sit in your corner saying, "Nuh uh," to whatever I post.

Grow up.

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Love and Peace and Toastpaint!

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Sorry to break toastpaint, Ian, but I have to finish this.

No I don't. I only "take shots" at things that anger me, and the statement you said angered me.

As for you not caring about what I say, fine. It wouldn't be the first time someone has done that to me.

Toastpaint

As for Europe is finished, I would look over here first. At the rate things are going the United States of America is going to be the Estados Unidos de América in about 50 years.

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I take offense to that!

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Once again, you make a fallacious assumption. It's STILL a slippery-slope fallacy, for one. For another, I think we can chuck up current theocracies involving Islam to the fact that they are in developing nations, wherein the mindset of the masses is far different from the mindset of developed countries. You think the causal difference is the religion itself, whereas to me, it seems clear that the causal difference is a long-established system of civil rights and independent thinkers within a country versus oppression and ignorance in another country. In essense, should Islam become a dominant religion in any Western European nation, I STILL see it as highly doubtful that such a nation would automatically change its long-established system of civil rights--a system built by and for free thinkers (and yes, there ARE free thinkers in Islam, just as their are in any other religion)--in favor of an oppressive theocracy.

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The meaning of life is 'bucket.'

FOR PONY!!!

Only you would take offense to statement saying that Latinos are going to take over America.

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Okay, but you're forgetting the story I linked to above. This man was allowed to beat his wife with no legal consequence because of the influence of Islamic law.

If that's not a step backward, I don't know what is.

I realize that there are free-thinkers in Islamic society, but for the most part their lives are threatened on a consistent basis because of their free-thinking. They are the minority.

Look at Iraq. They have the opportunity to build a democracy if they choose, but are instead killing each other left and right. There are thousands who'd rather destroy than build.

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Once again, I point out that Iraq is NOT a developed nation like nations in Western Europe are. They don't have the infrastructure, the educational and medical systems, nor the basic civil rights representative of a developed nation.

As for your step backward...you could say the same happens here in America when criminals who break into homes sue the homeowners--and win--because of personal injury they obtained while committing the crime of breaking and entering.

Remember that the etymological root of "Islam" means, essentially, "safety and peace." I've known plenty of Muslims, and none of them are the violent extremists so well known from the media. They aren't any different from you or I, save for religion, so to suggest that such a group of people threatens a host of developed nations and their established civil rights just doesn't hold water with me.

_________________
The meaning of life is 'bucket.'

FOR PONY!!!

Funny. I thought it meant "Submission."

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I don't think the actual meaning of the word has anything to do with its followers.

Islam can either mean "peace" or "submision to Allah". Either or, really.

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GENGHIS KHAN!!!!!

Europe finished? So its HP is critical and Islam in the fatality move?
I called Europe finished when Madonna moved over there.
(Take that, muahaha)

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TIRES TIRES TIRES

Lahi fails to mention that the decision was later reversed and the judge in question has since been removed from the case. Also, the verdict has kicked up a political firestorm in Germany. How we get from one judge making a bad decision to "Europe is over" is a bit baffling. Europe has survived one monumental crisis after another for centuries now; a little Muslim immigration is not going to end them.

Mike

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Logical fallacies ahoy! I'd also like to say: graaaaagh!

Besides, even if that were the case...


SPANISH INQUISITION'D!!

(Bet you didn't expect that - NOBODY expects the Spanish Inquisition!)

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It's not that I'm failing to mention it; I hadn't heard that until your post. Do you have a link?

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I have a couple.

The Ledger
Chicago Tribune

I can find more if that isn't enough.

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Yes I do. It might look a little familiar, though. Didn't you read the entire article? It's in the section entitled "The husband can beat his wife." Here's the paragraph in question (italics mine):



The decision was reversed a bit late, probably too late to do the wife in the case any real good, but it was reversed. To be fair, you're not the only one who missed that part; neither did anyone who was debating against you.

Mike

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Logical fallacies ahoy! I'd also like to say: graaaaagh!

To catch that, we'd actually have to read the actual article, rather than spouting off based on assumptions and first impressions. What are the chances of that happening?

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I don't think Europe is "finished", just because they're moving to Islam. I think someone said it best, countries like Iraq are not as developed as European nations. I don't think a change in the majority religion will cause a decay to a continent, though I do disagree with using religious text as the be-all-end-all (and I emphasize the be-all-end-all part) basis for civil laws.

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Characteristically, Islam has always had two bents: one more rational (represented by men like Averroes and Avicenna), and one more fundamentalist/extremist. My thought is that, as Islam does begin to pervade Europe, it will likely be represented by the former rather than the latter.

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You could paint many religions with that brush--even Atheism. Once an idea becomes big enough, you're inevitably going to get a fair share of really bad representatives of said idea, including those who go to violent, terroristic extremes to push their idea onto others. I've even gotten death threats from Buddhists before.

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The meaning of life is 'bucket.'

FOR PONY!!!

Dear lahimatoa,

We're still here. Don't worry about us.

Lots of love and fluffy puff marshmellows,

- Europe