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Benazir Bhutto Asassinated
http://forum.hrwiki.org/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=13214		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  The Great Clapper [ Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Benazir Bhutto Asassinated
Concerning the death directly

Some story progressing, behind the death

Now, stop me if I'm wrong, but I believe the correct words Bhutto used were 'If anything happens to me, I'm blaming Musharraf', this being said because she felt it was in the fault of lack of protection.

Some stuff about Bhutto

She will be missed by the people she fought for and this is not the last we shall hear of the situation, I am sure of it, anyways, just thought this was some news that deserved to be posted in here.

Thoughts, comments?
Author:  Inverse Tiger [ Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
A lot of news stories I've heard and read have portrayed her, despite her faults, as the only hope that Pakistan had for unity and eventual stability, and now that hope is gone. The implication being that Pakistan is screwed now and the "war on terror" is basically lost. Not that I think something so broad as a "war on terror" could ever be won anyway (just like the "war on drugs" or "war on poverty"), but the impending triumph of militant Islam sure is a lot to read into one person's death.

But this is a big deal for Pakistan. It's ensured their politics will be in disarray for at least another election cycle, probably longer.

There's definitely gonna be conspiracy theories about this. That maybe Musharraf was behind it and he knew al Qaeda would take responsibility because they WANT to be seen as doing this, giving him an easy out. I dunno.. it's possible since his grasp on power's getting pretty weak. Otherwise it'd be fairly obvious that people would see right through it or blame him anyway, like many Bhutto supporters are doing now.
Author:  The Great Clapper [ Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
Inverse Tiger wrote:
Not that I think something so broad as a "war on terror" could ever be won anyway (just like the "war on drugs" or "war on poverty"), but the impending triumph of militant Islam sure is a lot to read into one person's death.


I'd agree with you on the Terror part, but under the right circumstances, a war on poverty or drugs could be won, it would be hard to accomplish, but I see at least some amount of hope if any on such a material issue, if it is more of a way 'people feel', then there will always be a war about that going on, as the human emotion is something that is extremely hard if not possible to manage.
Author:  ChickenLeg [ Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
The Great Clapper wrote:
Inverse Tiger wrote:
Not that I think something so broad as a "war on terror" could ever be won anyway (just like the "war on drugs" or "war on poverty"), but the impending triumph of militant Islam sure is a lot to read into one person's death.


I'd agree with you on the Terror part, but under the right circumstances, a war on poverty or drugs could be won, it would be hard to accomplish, but I see at least some amount of hope if any on such a material issue, if it is more of a way 'people feel', then there will always be a war about that going on, as the human emotion is something that is extremely hard if not possible to manage.


There will always be poor people and there will always be drugs.

I need to get onto CNN or some sort of news station, since the only TV that's been happening is video games. :S
Author:  The Great Clapper [ Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:05 pm ]
Post subject: 
ChickenLeg wrote:
The Great Clapper wrote:
Inverse Tiger wrote:
Not that I think something so broad as a "war on terror" could ever be won anyway (just like the "war on drugs" or "war on poverty"), but the impending triumph of militant Islam sure is a lot to read into one person's death.


I'd agree with you on the Terror part, but under the right circumstances, a war on poverty or drugs could be won, it would be hard to accomplish, but I see at least some amount of hope if any on such a material issue, if it is more of a way 'people feel', then there will always be a war about that going on, as the human emotion is something that is extremely hard if not possible to manage.


There will always be poor people and there will always be drugs.


Sure, in the current realm of existence, but let us think about possibilities here.

What if we were a world that spread its money around equally?

What if no one accepted drugs?

Obviously, this is not the case, but with material posessions, and great force, it can be managed somehow.

Not too likely, but it is still in range of possibility, you can't disprove it.
Author:  Didymus [ Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
What if we were a world that spread its money around equally?

That would require a world without greed, and even to some extent, without personal desire. I'm not that confident in humanity's ability to overcome.

Not only that, but distribution of wealth is not the only problem. It is also management of that wealth. Once a person has adequate money, what kinds of decisions are they making with it?

Quote:
What if no one accepted drugs?

Once again, the human condition is going to prevent any real progress. Addiction is a real disease, and "will power" alone is not enough to overcome it. While I do not believe we should simply give up the struggle, the reality is that too many people will.

Quote:
Obviously, this is not the case, but with material posessions, and great force, it can be managed somehow.

Ah, but there's your problem. How much force is adequate? You'd pretty much need limitless resources and limitless military and police force to make it happen.

Not only that, but I do hope you realize that this was the basic founding philosophy behind the Soviet Union. In the end, it didn't work for them any better than our system works for us, and in the end, it failed miserably. The same basic premise is behind the current Chinese government, and while they still manage to maintain power, their system isn't solving all their problems either.

It might be within the realm of possibility, but the odds against the human race pulling it off are astronomically tiny, meaning that you might as well say it is impossible.
Author:  The Great Clapper [ Sat Dec 29, 2007 12:42 am ]
Post subject: 
Okay, okay, now you are making it clear, but we are also going off topic, no?

Anyways, all I know is that Bhutto fought for what she believed in by supporting the causes of the Pakistanian people, she got somewhat of a raw deal herself, what with her father being hanged for a crime he probably wasn't going to commit and in the first place most likely didn't initiate, then her brother.

But nobody seemed to really pay attention to those two tragedies for instance, justice was never really served, and heck, she still helped the little guy, however, I found it somewhat unprofessional when she said, 'I'm blaming Musharraf', because it was immaturely pointing a finger at someone else.

I say, if you are fighting for a cause you genuinely believe in that is to the concern of a great population of people, you simply present a case based on your views to a general people, not really being descriptive, but simply showing a way of improvement, which must be the goal for all countries really. And then we can just simply hope that everyone agrees and respects the desicion they make in their nation, not comparing the two ways of doing things in your protests, but showing a better way, and letting the people compare both for themselves.
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