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Hillary or Barack?
Hillary Clinton 4%  4%  [ 3 ]
Barack Obama 63%  63%  [ 42 ]
Neither 33%  33%  [ 22 ]
Total votes : 67
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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 12:35 am 
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I would like McCain if he weren't so...authoritarian, I dunno. I like his tax policies and all, but he supported the Patriot Act and staying in Iraq and...ugh, who knows.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:08 am 
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McCain's not a bad guy, I think, but I don't want him to be president. I'm just glad he ended up being the nominee rather than Romney or (shudder) Huckabee, but I'd still rather see a Democrat (any Democrat) win the White House. Actually, of all the possible Republicans, the only better choice they could have made was Chuck Hagel, if he had run. (NOT RON PAUL, WHO IS A PSYCHOPATH)

This election is shaping up to be a pretty good one for me and my ilk. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:18 am 
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So wait how is wanting to get out of Iraq, lowering taxes, and limiting government psychopathic again?

..Nevermind, I need to gb2/the Republican thread again.

Anyway Obama probably shouldn't have said that stuff about Pennsylvanians that made him lose, but it was pretty much the truth.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:21 am 
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HipHoppityFrogOfValue wrote:
So wait how is wanting to get out of Iraq, lowering taxes, and limiting government psychopathic again?

Anyway Obama probably shouldn't have said that stuff about Pennsylvanians that made him lose, but it was pretty much the truth.


That stuff's not psychopathic, but I for one like the Department of Education. And science.


And I don't think that stuff Obama said was TOO accurate. I'm from PA, and I'm not all that bitter - but then again, I'm probably not in the class of people he was talking about, like the blue-collar people and all that. For all I know, they're really bitter.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:24 am 
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Yeah, I'm not by any means trying to label anybody with any sort of stereotype. Just that those people DO exist.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:26 am 
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HipHoppityFrogOfValue wrote:
Yeah, I'm not by any means trying to label anybody with any sort of stereotype. Just that those people DO exist.


Yeah, probably. I just don't know any of them, or if I do, I don't know if they're bitter.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:23 am 
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I think McCain is fantastic.


I'm too lazy to check and see if you've expounded on this one.

What is so fantastic about McCain?

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:30 am 
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What is so fantastic about Clinton or Obama?

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:41 am 
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lahimatoa wrote:
Quote:
I think McCain is fantastic.


I'm too lazy to check and see if you've expounded on this one.

What is so fantastic about McCain?


That's what I thought when I read his post.

AbuGrape45 wrote:
What is so fantastic about Clinton or Obama?


By no means do I think Obama is fantastic, and certainly not Clinton. But Obama's better than everything else there is right now.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:44 am 
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lahimatoa wrote:
Quote:
I think McCain is fantastic.


I'm too lazy to check and see if you've expounded on this one.

What is so fantastic about McCain?
Coulter hates him. So does Limbaugh.
Any republican hated by them has to be doing something right.
Seriously, though, I like the fact that he seems to honest about things.
Take the economy, for instance. He told Detroit that the auto industry has left, maybe for good.
This is a true statement.
He didn't try to blow smoke up their butts. He told them like it was.

The "100 years quote". Granted, this has been misinterpreted, but he is letting us know that our middle east commitment is not a short-term thing. We've been in Germany and Japan for 60+ years. That was what he was talking about, bases and troops stationed there, not the Iraq war lasting 100 years (although I suspect it will last in one form or another until the last Sunni kills the last Shiite, then himself).

He also said he isn't really solid on the economy. He admits he doesn't know something. I'd take that over someone who claims to be able to cure every ill of America. It means he'll probably do a better job of surrounding himself with people who tell him what he needs to hear, not what he wants to hear.

Of course, I could go on and on, but it's late, and I have to be out of bed and running in about 6 hours.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:46 am 
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^ This. All of it.


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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:46 am 
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AbuGrape45 wrote:
What is so fantastic about Clinton or Obama?


Nothing, because they aren't Ron Paul. tee hee.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:37 pm 
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Woo, the awesomeness continues to come from every single pore of TFE.

Anyways, I just think that Obama and Clinton have said some things I disagree with, which is why I question everyone's superlatively positive things said about them.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:39 pm 
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Aww, Ron Paul's psychotic! I don't understand the whole cult mentality for him. Or Obama for that matter, though I do support him.


You know what would have been an interesting match-up? Ron Paul v. Dennis Kucinich for president. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:39 pm 
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AbuGrape45 wrote:
Woo, the awesomeness continues to come from every single pore of TFE.

Anyways, I just think that Obama and Clinton have said some things I disagree with, which is why I question everyone's superlatively positive things said about them.


That's why.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:39 pm 
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AbuGrape45 wrote:
Woo, the awesomeness continues to come from every single pore of TFE.


Image Image Image :mrgreen:

jithy wrote:
Aww, Ron Paul's psychotic! I don't understand the whole cult mentality for him. Or Obama for that matter, though I do support him.
You know what would have been an interesting match-up? Ron Paul v. Dennis Kucinich for president.


Seriously, they are in completely different leagues. Ron Paul is very sane - Do NOT pay attention to the propaganda. The man is very well spoken, and very real. He makes good horse-sense, to anybody who embraces the true American dream of Liberty. :usa:

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Last edited by TheFacelessEvil on Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:40 pm 
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Rusty wrote:
AbuGrape45 wrote:
Woo, the awesomeness continues to come from every single pore of TFE.

Anyways, I just think that Obama and Clinton have said some things I disagree with, which is why I question everyone's superlatively positive things said about them.


That's why.

Dude, seriously. Just because you're liberal...

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:42 pm 
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Ron Paul doesn't seem to be that sane. This book bomb seems to be a cry for attention.

*snootily sips on brandy*

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:44 pm 
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The Noid wrote:
Ron Paul doesn't seem to be that sane. This book bomb seems to be a cry for attention.

*snootily sips on brandy*


Except... That it wasn't his idea, it's the idea of his believers to GET him the attention he deserves? *scratch cheek*

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:45 pm 
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Ahh. See, I wasn't sure if it was his or not.

Ron Paul must have fangirls then.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:48 pm 
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The Noid wrote:
Ahh. See, I wasn't sure if it was his or not.

Ron Paul must have fangirls then.


"Hence the cult mentality thing. Anyone whose followers are that deranged probably can't be trusted," he said hypocritically, though he had supported and voted for Barack Obama, whose cult following had extended to the point where people wrote songs and poems about him.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:49 pm 
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JohnTheTinyCowboy wrote:
The Noid wrote:
Ahh. See, I wasn't sure if it was his or not.

Ron Paul must have fangirls then.


"Hence the cult mentality thing. Anyone whose followers are that deranged probably can't be trusted," he said hypocritically, though he had supported and voted for Barack Obama, whose cult following had extended to the point where people wrote songs and poems about him.


I don't see how buying his book is deranged, but OK.

*fangirls* ;o

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:52 pm 
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TheFacelessEvil wrote:
JohnTheTinyCowboy wrote:
The Noid wrote:
Ahh. See, I wasn't sure if it was his or not.

Ron Paul must have fangirls then.


"Hence the cult mentality thing. Anyone whose followers are that deranged probably can't be trusted," he said hypocritically, though he had supported and voted for Barack Obama, whose cult following had extended to the point where people wrote songs and poems about him.


I don't see how buying his book is deranged, but OK.

*fangirls* ;o


I just mean overall. People who are so wrapped up in the movement that they vehemently argue that he still has a chance of being the Republican nominee, people who like follow him around the country and stuff.


Plus, like I said before, I like the Department of Education.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:54 pm 
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JohnTheTinyCowboy wrote:
I just mean overall. People who are so wrapped up in the movement that they vehemently argue that he still has a chance of being the Republican nominee, people who like follow him around the country and stuff.

Plus, like I said before, I like the Department of Education.


haha, yeah those are crazies. BUT, that's only a small percentage of Ron Paul supporters. The majority of them (in Real Life, especially) are very sane, and very well spoken. Intelligent, even.

If it wasn't such a massive failure, I'd agree with you. However, the entire school system is falling apart like sand.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:57 pm 
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It may not be a very good system now, but why just totally abolish it? Don't we desperately need to improve America's educational system if we want to keep our current status in the world? We shouldn't just totally delete all the infrastructure, we should work on repairing it.

But I'm no analyst or anything, so I don't really have any idea what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 12:06 am 
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JohnTheTinyCowboy wrote:
It may not be a very good system now, but why just totally abolish it? Don't we desperately need to improve America's educational system if we want to keep our current status in the world? We shouldn't just totally delete all the infrastructure, we should work on repairing it.

But I'm no analyst or anything, so I don't really have any idea what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:


Yeah. Paul has the ins-and-outs of the plans that he speaks of. He's very much a tear-it-down and start-over kinda guy, which is cleaner then just trying to patch up the holes. Honestly, we've been trying to patch those holes for decades and it just doesn't work. DO OVER!!!!!! :sb:

But that's just me. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 2:11 am 
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JohnTheTinyCowboy wrote:
It may not be a very good system now, but why just totally abolish it? Don't we desperately need to improve America's educational system if we want to keep our current status in the world? We shouldn't just totally delete all the infrastructure, we should work on repairing it.

But I'm no analyst or anything, so I don't really have any idea what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:
Nonononononono.

He wants to get rid of the department of education at the FEDERAL LEVEL. Not entirely. That's as much of a misquote as the 100-years-McCain thing. Because right now, the department of education at the national level doesn't do much other than take tax money and take power away from the states.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 2:13 am 
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HipHoppityFrogOfValue wrote:
JohnTheTinyCowboy wrote:
It may not be a very good system now, but why just totally abolish it? Don't we desperately need to improve America's educational system if we want to keep our current status in the world? We shouldn't just totally delete all the infrastructure, we should work on repairing it.

But I'm no analyst or anything, so I don't really have any idea what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:
Nonononononono.

He wants to get rid of the department of education at the FEDERAL LEVEL. Not entirely. That's as much of a misquote as the 100-years-McCain thing. Because right now, the department of education at the national level doesn't do much other than take tax money and take power away from the states.


Yeah. He's all about state-level-responsibility. Much like his views on gay marriage and the like. I love his concepts, gives very much of a 'local feel'.

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 2:29 am 
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TheFacelessEvil wrote:
HipHoppityFrogOfValue wrote:
JohnTheTinyCowboy wrote:
It may not be a very good system now, but why just totally abolish it? Don't we desperately need to improve America's educational system if we want to keep our current status in the world? We shouldn't just totally delete all the infrastructure, we should work on repairing it.

But I'm no analyst or anything, so I don't really have any idea what I'm talking about. :mrgreen:
Nonononononono.

He wants to get rid of the department of education at the FEDERAL LEVEL. Not entirely. That's as much of a misquote as the 100-years-McCain thing. Because right now, the department of education at the national level doesn't do much other than take tax money and take power away from the states.


Yeah. He's all about state-level-responsibility. Much like his views on gay marriage and the like. I love his concepts, gives very much of a 'local feel'.

I don't like the idea of putting gay marriage on the states, just because of what it can do.
If Johnny and Greg are married (legally) in a state, say Nebraska (don't think they recognize gay marriage, but assume they do) and Johhny is able to have insurance as Greg's husband through Greg's employer, then they move to another state that does not recognize gay marriage, say, South Dakota, then Johnny can lose his insurance.

Patchwork laws don't work.
I say just go ahead and legalize (or whatever the word is) or ban gay marriage at the federal level and be done with it. Actually, legalizing it wouldn't bother me at all. I'm married and I feel that every person on this planet has the right to be as miserable as I am (I kid, I kid... about the miserable part, anyway).

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 Post subject: Re: Obama or Clinton?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 2:32 am 
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StrongRad wrote:
I don't like the idea of putting gay marriage on the states, just because of what it can do.
If Johnny and Greg are married (legally) in a state, say Nebraska (don't think they recognize gay marriage, but assume they do) and Johhny is able to have insurance as Greg's husband through Greg's employer, then they move to another state that does not recognize gay marriage, say, South Dakota, then Johnny can lose his insurance.

Patchwork laws don't work.
I say just go ahead and legalize (or whatever the word is) or ban gay marriage at the federal level and be done with it. Actually, legalizing it wouldn't bother me at all. I'm married and I feel that every person on this planet has the right to be as miserable as I am (I kid, I kid... about the miserable part, anyway).


HAHA! While I agree with you on every level (being a gay woman myself who can't marry her 'spouse'), I'm also a realist. I'll take what I can get at this point and time, and if that means patchworking then I'm just fine with it. States have twelve million different laws, I don't see why this one can't be one of them until everybody gets their heads out of their butts and just legalizes it.

I, personally, just wouldn't move out of my gay state. And that's the way of it.

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