Homestar Runner Wiki Forum

I don't know if there is already a thread for this, but it is an important topic.

A story in the Washington Post tells of a pastor at a Baptist church in North Carolina that kicked out 9 of its members for voting for John Kerry in the presidential election and not repenting. "He went on and on about how he's going to bring politics up, and if we didn't agree with him, we should leave," Isaac Sutton told The News and Observer of Raleigh. "I think I deserve the right to vote for who I want to."
As a result, 40 others (both democrat and republican) quit their membership to the church as a sign of protest.
There have been news articles reporting that many feel that the Bush Administration is an administration that is "finally working under God." Conservative agendas in Congress and Executive branch now focus more on values and morals, as indicated by Terry Schiavo and stem cell research restrictions.

Is there no longer a line between church and state? How do you feel about the government's new focus?

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I don't like it. I think the separation of church and state is for the church's benefit. If I'd been a member of that church, I would have ended my membership as well.

[slightly off topic rant]
During Bush's first term, (especially post-911) I was under the belief that the country should stand firmly behind the president. After gas reaching over 2 bucks/gallon, me getting almost none of my taxes back (and I make next to nothing...I'm an actress), Bush banning stem cell research ([sarcasm] because throwing those embryos away is a GREAT testament to the sacredness of life! [/sarcasm]), with talk of him banning abortion ([more sarcasm] cause that'll solve EVERYTHING instead of making things worse[/sarcasm]), and our men and women dying in Iraq for seemingly no reason, I'm about ready to march on Washington. Who else wants to go?
[/slightly off topic rant]

It's gonna be a looooong 3 and a half years.

Back on topic. I don't see Bush's regime as "working under God". I think they're "working under their own ridiculous political agenda". There are now even Republicans in Congress who disagree with many of the things Dubya is doing.

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Those are the moderate republicans, the far right-wingers are behind Crawford, Texas' village idiot. I don't mind the moderates, its the bible-thumping republicans that are the problem.

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I would have quit my membership as well. But my religion is very open minded. They let women in their affairs since they very first started, and that was before women's rights were even conceived of.

[offtopic] It really bugs me when people rant about Bush. Gas prices are eventually going to go up anyway. Would you rather have them lower for a few more years, and have smog from refineing facillities all over the place? Banning stem cell research, I think, was probably a good idea. I just read Ender's Shadow and all the books after that. It's about a little boy that had a key turned in his genetic material. It made him really really smart, but it made him die about the age of 16. Secret genetic experiments were done and it ruined the life of this little boy. Those scientists then made a virus that they were going to deploy that would make this change in everyone that got it. Think of dynamite. It was conceived for good purposes, but eventually used for bad ones. Think of what would happen if some terrorists got there hands on phenomenol accidental genetic discovereys? The kind that they could make almost invinceble people?

About abortion. They should have abortion for medical emergancies. Any 16 year old having an affair with her boyfriend and gets pregnant because of it, should have to deal with the consequences. Maybe there is a reason that god made us the way that we are. Women can get pregnant if they have sex, right? Just because men have found a way to prevent it, doesn't mean that we should go do it all the time. But the best way to solve all this is to have sex only with lawful marrige, and then if you get pregnant, it's less of a situation.


In Iraq, we sent soldiers there to give Iraq democrecy and to fight terrorism. We finished one thing, we are doing the other. How do you know that all the soldiers are actually hot on the trail of the terrorists, but they can't tell you because then you'd go tell them because you hate Bush so much. (Oh, that was a bit harsh, sorry.) But seriously, there are most likely secret operations that will turn out to our benifit, but they can't tell us because if word got out, the operations would fail.

No, I don't want to march into washington and protest. Every president has made mistakes, even the best ones. Concetrate on the good. I would say though, Bush is a releif next to the Clintons. He just really bugs me.

This is my political veiw on Bush, I'm sure there are plenty of holes in it because I don't know that much about polotics. If you would like to discuss it with me, Email/PM me and wwe will have a heartwarming disscusion. This is the wrong place to talk about it. Bah, Toastpaint
[/offtopic]

Seperation between church and state is one of the best things that this country has come up with. Any pastor or bishop that commands you to vote for a candidite shouldn't be the pastor/bishop in the first place. I beleive that Americans are mostly smart and they will choose the best president that they can.

Well, I won't get into presidential stuff, but in general, I think that separation of church and state is a good thing for everyone, but some people take it to an extreme. A public school should not force children to pray, but it should not be allowed to punish them for praying, as long as it is not an interference to the educational process (praying at recess, for instance, harms no one). Religion should not be the taboo subject that it has become in public schools, although I do believe that staff/administration should not endorse a particular belief system.

One thing that bugs me particularly is when I hear about schools that teach children about the religious and cultural aspects of every december holiday except Christmas. When "separation of church and state" becomes a weapon against one particular religious group, things have gone too far. It doesn't help anybody to ignore a particular religion, or religion in general, because it's a very important part of society, and ignorance of it only leads to intolerance.

The US Constitution guarantees freedom of religion, not freedom from hearing about it. The state cannot enforce a certain belief system, but neither can it censor one, even in a public place. The whole idea of this separation is to prevent any one religion from being forced upon us, and also to keep the government's nose out of church business. It works quite well when church and state at least acknowledge each other.

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"There's two kinds of people in this world: me, and everybody else. In that order."
-me
"Like you aren't an easy jab for my witty glivers and put-dubs."
-Stong Buh

I agree (mostly) with Ungurait#7. People certainly have a right to uphold and carry out religious beliefs, but not to the point of forcing others to do what a religion says. I don't think that current political situations are really helping with the current seperation of church/ state situation. There is still religious force all around the country.

On another note: Haven't these issues been discussesd elsewhere on the forum?

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171st POST ANNIVERSARY!!!

As atheist and unbiased as we'd like our government to be, faith has helped our counrty become what it is today and will most likely continue to do so.

- Every dollar bill you possess says "In God We Trust."

- The unfinished pyramid overseen by the all seeing eye on the back of a dollar bill, the symbol that everyone's talked about for the past year, was intended to symbolize the persistant building of America; our persistance toward perfection symbolized by the unfinished pyramid overseen by a higher power (all seeing eye).

- New American citizens must take their oath "So help [them] God."

America wouldn't exist if it weren't for the faith of those before us.

oh no i think the state should be with the church so everyone can choose the path of good

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What idiot thought the idea of putting the hole on the BUTT of them?Take a look one day!Notice those holes on top?Well thats where the Salt come out right?Well if you put the opening on butt guess what!When you go to fill them it is is going to spill and make a freaking mess all over myfloor!-Didy

I don't know whether you're being sarcastic or not, Frotzie. Doesn't everyone have the opportunity to "choose the path of good" without the government enforcing it? What do you mean by "the path of good", anyway?

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"There's two kinds of people in this world: me, and everybody else. In that order."
-me
"Like you aren't an easy jab for my witty glivers and put-dubs."
-Stong Buh

The ultimate point is that it is just as much in the church's best interest as it is the state's for them to stay separate. Neither body wants the other to rule over it.

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Exactly. What people often forget is that forcing children not to pray is just as bad as forcing them to pray. A secular nation doesn't mean an atheist nation, so to speak.



...ah. So do you think forcing your beliefs on others constitutes "the path of good"?

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"You get the Most Annoying Transsexual I've Ever Spoken To award." -The Zephyr Song