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I didn't see another topic about this... so I hope it hasn't been posted somewhere else.

Anyway, what is your take on the UFO sightings and "abductions"? I'm a Christian, so I'm interested to see what the other Christians on this forum think too. I'm not going to throw my opinion out yet, though, until I hear some of you guyses opinions.

So what do you think?

I highly doubt anyone's ever been abducted (but, then again, that's what they want you to believe). I do think there are more... beings in the universe, though. It's one of the only times I've agreed with Tom Cruise. He's still insane, though, but that's a different story...

Actually several people have reported being abducted, and none of them were crazy. They reported being experimented on in gross ways, and being told by the aliens that the aliens were preparing them for a special mission.

Weird. Possibly a lie.

I really don't know what to think about aliens. I mean, sure, the Bible doesn't say anything about other races (I don't think), but it could just be that, for whatever reason, they really aren't all that important for faith and salvation. I'm not sure. It really seems like God was going out of his way to create the entire universe and only put life on one planet. Of course, I can't claim to speak for God, but, I know that I wouldn't have put all that effort into creating such a large universe if I was only going to put life on one planet (If you're athiest, or otherwise don't believe in creation, surely you would still agree. Surely, the processes that created life wouldn't have only happened here.). Like the quote from "Contact" says: "It seems like an awful waste of space."

I do believe that the US government was involved in a massive plot concerning UFOs during the Roswell era. If you look at the time that was going on (opening rounds of the cold war) and you see that both sides
were spying on each other quite heavily (you can't be without any technology your opponent has), then you will kind of understand the basis of my idea.
The Soviets were still working on their nuclear program. The US was trying to delay them as much as possible. The Soviets were, no doubt, getting some assistance from spies (either KGB agents or people that saw the dangers in only one side of the cold war having nuclear weapons). In an attempt to draw espionage resources away from nuclear secrets (among other techno goodies), the US created the crash at Roswell, and, then deliberately changed the story of what happened (and most likely paid some people to point this out and yell "Conspiracy!" and spin tales of alien technology, and of strange craft). The Russians, seeing this would, no doubt, take interest and divert some of their resources to getting their hands on the (non-existant) technologies recovered from space craft at Roswell (According to a show on the History Channel, the KGB actually had a unit that was specifically tasked with investigating the alien technologies "recovered" at Roswell). Of course, this is just my take on the whole "Alien Coverup" thing. It's no more off the wall than any other theories that have been developed regarding aliens and UFO's.

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I think some abduction accounts could possibly be the people just trying to get attention or publicity or something. I don't believe them to be true. However, I believe there could be life out there, but maybe not intelligent.

I don't think anyone has seriously been abducted, but there is life out there. If there isn't, then the universe is just one big waste of space.

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Okay, here's my take. It's pretty long.

In Genesis, It says something like the "sons of God" [angels, but fallen because of what they're going to do, so they're demons] came and bred with human women. This created a super race of demon-men, called the Nephilim. These are actually mentioned in the Bible by this name, and are also responsible for Goliath of Gath, the giant Canaanites, and the sons of Anak. These demon-men experimented with "genetic engineering", such as giant fruit, but worst, fusing animals and man. These Nephilim are responsible for the "Egyptian Gods", with like the hawk heads, lion bodies, and other stuff. Now, before you say, that these are just representations of the gods, think. Would the Egyptians just make up that stuff? It's pretty wierd. The "gods" would have had to appear to them at least once to give them an idea of what they look like. Anyway, one of the Egyptian Gods's name was Ishtar, or Ashtar, or something like that. More on him later.

Anyway, these Egyptian gods are not heard from anymore. They did not die, becasue they're immortal. (Demons, remember?) Okay. So what does all this have to do with aliens? Let's assume that demons, angels, and supernatural beings can be described as being inter-dimensional. Say you were a 2-dimensional species. If a 3-dimensional person drew a circle around you, you would not be able to move past it, unless you became three dimensional. It's the same with supernatural stuff. They are entering our dimension. When people were "abducted", which they BELIEVE they were, they are brought to the location of the aliens, which are also inter-dimensional, appearing spontaneously at some locations. Here, they are experimented on, and told they have a mission. They are then sent back to their lives, where all "abductees" begin to develop a strange interest in the occult, where none existed before. Some people even report being shown things from the future, which the aliens say is the end of the world. The things they show PARALLEL EXACTLY WITH THE BIBLE'S DESCRIPTION OF THE END OF THE WORLD, Excpet with Satan as a good alien and Jesus as the evil alien. Do you see what I'm saying? These aliens are demons, sent to decieve us. Oh, and that Ishtar/Ashtar demon guy? The aliens have a commander, named Ashtar. Coincidence? I think not. He leads a "fleet of alien ships", known as the Ashtar command.

Anyway, that's my theory. Hope it's not too confusing.

Interesting Douglas. Very interesting. What you said gets my thinking.

You mean you agree?

Not that I agree, but I certainly think it is very believable in my eyes. It just got me thinking about how Satan works. He is very manipulative. I think your opinion could possibly be close to the truth.

Woo! Thanks!

Anid I just remembered something... No Christian has ever been abducted. One Christian Guy told the story once of how he was sleeping one night and...

(Don't read the following if you are squeamish and easily offended)



So he called out "Jesus, help me!" And the pain stopped, the light went away, and he fell back onto his bed, at which his wife woke up.

@_@ Demons are powerful. I'll give them that. But, there is someone who is way more powerful than they can reach!

there has to be some other life form out there! And i do believe we have aliens living among us....that green skinned kid with no ears and the zit name postulio. But seriously how can we be so self-centered to believe nothing else is out there. I mean look at the channels on mars! I think mars used to be a thriving society but they used up all of there resources and their atmosphere. Mars is just a glimpse into earth future.

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TIRES TIRES TIRES

But there's no evidence that the canals were built by design. And there's no evidence of technology or population that has been discovered, and considering that you can see our cities from space, I'm sure you should be able to see theirs, if there ever were any. And large cities would be the only possible explanation for such a depletion of natural resources.

As for Christian opinions on life on other worlds, anyone here ever read Out of the Silent Planet or Perelandra?

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Here's what I think about Mars:

In the book of Isaiah, God speaks of an evil king (of some place in the Middle East). Obviously, he is talking about Satan here wheen you read it. Anyway, I think its from here that you can see how God is talking of ANOTHER PLANET in our solar system called Rahab. This was Satan's throne, before he became evil. When he fell, God destroyed his planet, TURNING IT INTO THE ASTEROID BELT. Okay. Now before Satan fell, my theory is that angels sort of "lived" on each of the inner planets. That would explain your canals. So, Mercury, Venus, Earth, and Mars were all nice. The destruction of Rahab obliterated Mars's surface, knocked Earth slightly off axis, created the acid cloud around Venus, superheating its surface, and fried Mercury by pushing it too close to the sun. God chose Earth to be his planet, and started over.

Actually, if you're talking about Isaiah 51, it is a poetic retelling of the plagues of Egypt in Exodus. Rahab is a name for Egypt, and the Burninator is a reference to the devil. This passage is not talking about a planet, but about how God struck down the enemies of his people and led them to freedom, despite the arrogance of Pharaoh and the opposition of Satan. The reference to the seas drying up is the parting of the Red Sea (note it is called a way for the Redeemed). And in that event, the Lord also destroyed the armies of Pharaoh (i.e., crushing Rahab) by causing them to be swallowed by the same sea through which the Israelites had passed.

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OK. Wow. You've got some pretty...out-there ideas, Douglas.



This is false. Most abductees have been Christian. Though I can't say if they were actually abducted, saying that no Christians have ever even claimed to be abducted is just blatantly false. Look at the Hill case of 1961. Betty and Barney Hill were Christian. Heck, Jimmy Carter once saw a UFO. He wasn't abducted, but he saw it.



Can you give an example of this? I'd just like to know where you get your ideas.

Look, I'm Catholic. I believe in aliens. The universe we can see is 13 billion lightyears in diameter. It is almost infinitely bigger than what we can see. There are millions of galaxies, each with billions of stars, each with a potential for planets capable of life. Believing that only our planet is inhabited seems to me to be ignoring the facts.

Thank you, Didymus, for explaining the whole Rahab thing better than I could have. Your Biblical knowledge is a great asset to the forum.

I doubt that aliens are demons trying to trick us. No disrespect intended, that's just how I feel. To each his own opinion, right?

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beep beep I'm a Jeep

What happened to the Nephilim Mr. Douglas? Why arn't they raising cain right now?

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RIP Nathan "Buz" Buzdor

Well, I can't miss any of the action.
Okay. I be thinking that demons are as subject to God's will as anything else. It makes sense to me. Think about it.

In the book of Job, God had to GIVE Satan the power to torment Job. That's SATAN we're talking about. Lord of the Renegades, ect., ect., ect. So to say that a lowly demon could come and do the same thing... I don't think so.

Let's take a look at some things in ha-da Bible. The Bible has some stuff in it. Said stuff being about possessions. Now; Jesus cast out a demon possessing a human, did he not? Yes. God GAVE the demon the ability to possess that one human in order to help support Jesus' claim he was the son of God.

That's my logic of the day. Kk.

Oh, wait. This is about ALIENS. Or is it? I dunno. It got kind of off-topic. So, my thoughts about aliens.
They exist. However... they have never come to Earth. Ever. You know why? Well, I'll tell you. You see, travelling at the speed of light is entirely possible. However, in order to travel at the speed of light, you would have to use ALL OF THE ENERGY IN THE WHOLE UNIVERSE. By doing so, you would cause the heat death of the universe. Way to go.

And furthermore, it's nigh impossible to harness all that power.
I think of these things in terms of science, not in terms of the legal system (as in, with witnesses and such).

Was there a Roswell alien-crash? No. There was a crash. Not an alien crash. Let's think this through. These aliens come all the way here, dodging asteroids, planets, planetoids, nebulae, stars, black holes, and neutron stars, but those telephone wires sure are a doosy!

To conclude, I totally own. Oh, and thanks for all the cheese.

You're right about the whole faster-than-light thing. I think, though, that it is possible that there are other forms of travel through space that are possible, like wormholes or other ways of bending space-time. I also think that if the aliens are able to come here, that they would, by necessity, have developed this technology. So it's possible that aliens have come here, but maybe not in any form of conventional travel that we'd recognize.

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beep beep I'm a Jeep

Aliens: yes
Aliens on/visited Earth: no
Time travel: here's an article

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>>internet entertainment

Didymus: : I got my idea of Rahab from Ezekiel 28. See in the second part of the speech to the King of Tyre how God is talking about Satan. Then see at the end how he states that he "made a fire come out from him and reduced him to ashes." I theorized that since that never really happened to Satan, God destroyed Satan's heavenly throne, "Rahab". I further theorized that this knocked everything else slightly off kilter (Earth being 365 1/4 days instead of 366, THE NUMBER OF DAYS ON THE ORIGINAL JEWISH CALENDAR.)

JTTC: My ideas come from a book called "Alien Intrusion" by Gary Bates. You should look at it. It's really interesting.

Tor: The Nephilim were sealed in a place in hell called Tartarus. This is mentioned in the Bible a few times.

EDIT: Tor, I think the Nephilim will come back during the end times. In Revelation, God talks about Apollyon, "the one who destroys." There is also a Greek God (Nephilim) named Apollo. His chains are released, the ones that bind him in Tartarus.

Guys, remember, my ideas are just ideas. They might not even be true. So don't take what I'm saying as the truth. The Bible's the only reliable source of info.

I hope you don't take that book too seriously. I did a little research on Google about that book and from what I found there combined with what you posted about this guy's theories, it seemed a little...I don't know, out there.

I can't understand why so many people feel the need to rationalize aliens as being demons or other kinds of supernatural phenomena, and why they can't accept the idea that HUMANITY IS NOT THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IN THE UNIVERSE. Even in the Bible, some people claim, is evidence for aliens, like Ezekiel's wheels, or the Pillars of Cloud/Fire.

Oh, and Tartarus was the darkest part of Greek Hades, where the Titans were sent after losing the war with the gods. Whatever you heard about the nephilim probably came directly from that.

EDIT: After seeing your edit, I wanted to add a few things. I do not believe that the Greek or Roman or Egyptian gods were based on any factual beings. There never were any beings such as Apollo or Osiris or any other of these beings, whether they were nephilim or actual deities.

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beep beep I'm a Jeep

I just combined some of the stuff that he said with some stuff from the Bible.



Actually, one could say that it is, as God became man for us. Would he have had to become an alien to save other species as well? Doubtful.



Ezekiel's wheels were describing the solar system and planetary orbits. The Pillars of Cloud/Fire were God's way of showing himself to the Israelites.



The Nephilim are directly referred to in the Bible, as well as Tartarus. I don't think it's called Tartarus in English, but in the original Greek it is. The myth of the Titans actually has some truth in it. The Titans are the Nephilim, the mutant demon-men. The "gods" are the armies of God, angels and stuff. The angels imprisoned the Nephilim in Tartarus. So, I did couple that myth with information from the Bible. I could be wrong, though.[/quote]

I'm curious to know what Didymus thinks of the Nephilim.

I just combined some of the stuff that he said with some stuff from the Bible.



Actually, one could say that it is, as God became man for us. Would he have had to become an alien to save other species as well? Doubtful.



Ezekiel's wheels were describing the solar system and planetary orbits. The Pillars of Cloud/Fire were God's way of showing himself to the Israelites.



The Nephilim are directly referred to in the Bible, as well as Tartarus. I don't think it's called Tartarus in English, but in the original Greek it is. The myth of the Titans actually has some truth in it. The Titans are the Nephilim, the mutant demon-men. The "gods" are the armies of God, angels and stuff. The angels imprisoned the Nephilim in Tartarus. So, I did couple that myth with information from the Bible. I could be wrong, though.

I'm curious to know what Didymus thinks of the Nephilim.

ok, what i believ is this: judging by everything that science has proven, there might not be a god. as i belive, yes there is a god, a God that rules over the entire univers, but comes to many people in different forms, and the god has created all sorts of life elsewhere within the univers, that there are other beings, and in which 1 day, we will all join eachother, for the final Passing of the univers at to which it will implode, and cause feedback on the other surrounding, and corrosponding universes will feel. yeah........... hard to understand, but i dont know how to put it into words.

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Oops, accidental double-post, eh Douglas?



Actually, that is exactly how some people can reconcile the idea of aliens with Christianity. They believe that Jesus had to have been born on any planet with alien life in order to save them and that this means that He suffered infinitely more than we know.



Right, that's what the Bible says. But some people don't take the Bible literally. Many people believe that when the Bible calls the Pillars of Cloud and Fire God, that it was just the author's attempt to describe something that he had no understanding of. Which could have been aliens.

As for nephilim, I don't believe in them. I do not take everything in the Bible literally, like much of the Book of Genesis.

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beep beep I'm a Jeep

Okay, I think Douglas is "misquoting".

Now, the Bible was written in two languages: Greek and Aramaaic (sp, perhaps?). Tartarus, despite what Douglas believes, is actually just a Greek word for Hell. In fact, the Greeks had many, many, many words for Hell. Hades, Elysium, Carceri...

Thanks for watching, and for all the cheese.

That's a nice theory, but knowing the original language of the manuscripts as well as a little history of the time period helps. That's where I come in. The term Rahab used in Scripture (dang, I wish there was a decent Hebrew font to use for this) literally means "arrogant," and according to Brown Driver Briggs Hebrew-English Lexicon of the Old Testament, this was a term used by the Hebrew people to refer to Pharaoh and the Egyptians. (this is not to be confused with Rahab, the name of a prostitute who helped Joshua's army - her name was spelled different in Hebrew, though pronounced the same in English).


Except that απολλυων in Greek is not related to the name of the Greek god. απολλυων comes from απο (from) and λυω (loose, destroy), and literally means "Destroyer." It is actually a transliteration of the name αβαδδων, which in Hebrew means "Destruction." In other words, αβαδδων and απολλυων are essentially the same word, only one is Hebrew and the other Greek. απολλω is not related to either of them, though. (although I have not been able to confirm yet, I think απολλω is from απο and ηλιος, which is Greek for Sun. Either way, it's not related to απολλυων.

You might be interested to know that απολλω is mentioned in the Bible. Acts 18-19, and again in I Corinthians. It was the name of one of the disciples who worked with St. Paul.

Also, do not take my responses as trying to rip you to shreds. It's just that I have some training in biblical studies (actually have a bachelors and a masters in it) and just want to offer my insights as a professional. I appreciate that you propose these only as possible theories.

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