Homestar Runner Wiki Forum

Because I am trying to fully grasp both sides of this controversial issue, I just want to hear as much information as I can for and against homosexual marriages. If this is an "unsafe" issue, I understand its removal.

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The Brothers E

I am against gay marriages. A lot of people seem to be happy with just boy and girl marriages. I think two of the same genders getting married is just very strange and should never happen. Plus, they wouldn't be able to have kids.

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This will sound strange coming from a very conservative republican, such as myself, but I don't see it as a problem. Homosexual marriage doesn't concern me. I look at it this way, if gay marriage was the biggest "threat" facing our nation (not saying it is a threat), then I wouldn't care about it being brought up. But we have MANY MANY bigger problems to worry about, things like nearly 1000 US soldiers dead from a war that, while justified to me, we were misled into (I feel that the ends somewhat justify the means, but we WERE lied to by SOMEONE, we shoulda gone in under the truth, but that's another thread), the threat of another terrorist attack, a presidential election in which both candidates seem to want to re-fight the viet nam war, and an economy that is starting to show signs of slipping, just to name a few.
As far as my opinion as a Christian, I feel that IF homosexuality is a sin, then, those who are guilty will recieve their punishment in Hell (a punishment far worse than anything we can do here), and, if it is not, then there is no reason to persecute homosexuals here.
As for homosexuality being a mockery of a sacred union, I submit to you that, in my opinion, it is no worse than the high percentage of marriages that end in divorce. So much for the sacred Union...
I don't agree with Shopiom, but I do not think it was biggoted or anything like that, and I don't think anyone should attempt to argue with him on it. It's his opinion, which he has a right to, just as we all have a right to ours.... But that's up to the mods to decide.

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If you can't fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

That's a very good point there, I just think that if two people love each other, then why can't they be together? It doesn't matter what gender they are and I see nothing wrong with homosexuality at all.
It is though a little disturbing when they are sitting right in front of you pashing and stuff, but there are no laws against it.

- M.J -

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- Matt Chapman's obsessed fan.

That's nearly exactly what I was going to say...

Short of one thing. (the very last point). I don't think it is wrong to disagree, or even argue, with someone over this (or any) issue. That is what a forum is all about. The important thing is to remain civil.

Once people get out of hand, that is when the authorities step in.

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I agree with ya on that... That's what I'm meaning... Debate is good, but when I say "argue" I'm meaning the kind of "debate" you usually read in editorial pages.... You know where it's not, "I don't agree with you on that, because my personal beliefs are...", it's usually more like "You're wrong, you're stupid and you're a hatemongering bigot! I bet that you would have been good friends with <insert some historical "evil" person>"

That's the one thing I like about debate on these boards... It usually don't get to that. They either lock the thread, kick people out, or make their head 'asplode.... Good mods!

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If you can't fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

yeah. Personally I am a Democrat. A jewish one at that. (but that doesn't matter) When the constitution was written up in 1776 and they said "all men are created equal, under god" They really meant all white heterosesxual men, not black and/or gay men. then it meant, black and white heterosexual men, not women and/or gay/lesbian. now we're getting there but not quite yet. I know we can get this.

Another thing why do we need an amendment to stop it. Don't forget, we still have our rights as a citizen and somewhere in there it says we have a right to choose.

yeah. Personally I am a Democrat. A jewish one at that. (but that doesn't matter) When the constitution was written up in 1776 and they said "all men are created equal, under god" They really meant all white heterosesxual men, not black and/or gay men. then it meant, black and white heterosexual men, not women and/or gay/lesbian. now we're getting there but not quite yet. I know we can get this.

Another thing why do we need an amendment to stop it. Don't forget, we still have our rights as a citizen and somewhere in there it says we have a right to choose.

You can't fight love.

Love always wins.

I'm for gay marriages. I don't see how it would affect my life so I'm for it.

Read StrongRad's post if you want my opinion - he pretty much lines up with my ideas on this subject...as long as homosexuals aren't hurting anyone (and they aren't) what business is it of the rest of society? Some homosexual marriages are probably more sound than many heterosexual marriages!

Children in same-sex families is another issue too. I think it was Oprah Winfrey who said, "Whoever can love the child best should raise the child." Granted, it would be good if the child could have a role model of the other sex...but other family members could provide that. Some people think that homosexual parents "create" homosexual children...I don't think that's true. (If it was true, then wouldn't we NOT have homosexuals - that is, wouldn't straight parents "create" straight children?) I remember Rosie O'Donnel's big coming out interview a few years ago and she said she told her son that "most boys like girls, but some boys like boys and some girls like girls"...she also said that she hoped that her children were heterosexual - simply because she felt their lives would be easier than hers had been.

All I know is that I believe love is so important in this world today - there's too little of it, so why stamp it out like this? If people are happy and leading fulfilling lives and not hurting anyone else, then we should let them be!

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i see no reason why they can't get married...why aren't any of you guys president?!?

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if you could choose your ancestors, and grow just like a weed
pick a stud to congeal your blood and get your earlobes free

The bible says you ought not lay with another man!!!

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That is one Ugly bird....

I'm just gonna quote myself from the other topic, because this is still The Worst Justification For Limiting Civil Liberties Ever:





And the question still isn't rhetorical.

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Give me about 15 years to build my political career and I will be!!!
I just need a VP... Prolly one of those celeb types, to get votes. I'm thinking Ben Affleck. I'm conservative, he's liberal. It'd be a balanced ticket. As the conservative, I could do the things we cons do "best": defense, business, while Ben could do the liberal things: social programs, education... It'd be a win-win situation!

The best thing is, when something I was for, say an unpopular but, maybe slightly justified war, was not going so well, I wouldn't do something, say suggest we ban gay marriages, and be labeled as a hatemonger, just to "Wag the Dog"

Now that I think about it, a Unified ticket would be great. I know I'd vote for it.

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If you can't fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

Sums up what I was about to say. It's a human right to express your wuv for someone.(Oh wait... I mean love. Of corse. Love. *shifty eyes*)

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Spaceballs: The Sig

I live in Canada..where gay marriages are allowed *gasp*. Nah, i am an anglican christian (not strictly mind you..) but I do believe they should be allowed to marry just like heterosexual couples, as they should be allowed a right to a life together and to be married without persecution. They can't help that they aren't heterosexual, why deny them their rights? Besides, not everyone in North America is Christian or even religious at all..and Canada and the U.S. are free countries.

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"well, I'll just uh, put these pants on." ~Homestar

I'm with the crowd on this one; a passage from the Bible which says X is wrong carries no weight with me, nor should it carry any weight with the country's legal system (isn't there supposed to be a separation of church and state?).

Personally, I think it's disgusting and deeply hypocritical that the governors of a supposedly secular nation are still apparently governed by the Bible (the words "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance is a typical example). I could go off on a large tangent about this, but I'll stop there.

That guy? That's the number one thing I dislike about Kerry: he would approve of his beloved daughter dating that two bit hack. And not only that, but go "on tour" with him. I bet Ben makes the Kerry clan watch all his movies so he can complain about the way the other actors don't support him.

Oh, yeah, so I...don't like Ben Affleck.

This is sarcasm, right? You know it was just a tabloid rumour... right?

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Personally, I'm against homosexual marriages. My personal beliefs say that it is wrong, but I'm not gonna go shoot someone because they are homosexual. Sometimes I hear people say "I was born this way," or "I'm a man born in a woman's body" or vice versa. Homosexuality isn't what you're born with. Its an acquired state of mind, as you may have heard me say before. I'm not saying all gay people think that way.

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LOL. Clearly you've never spoken to an actual gay person about it.

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If I tell you, it will ruin the air of mystery.

I totally agree...one of my close friends is a bisexual, and trust me. It's not an acquired state of mind.

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"well, I'll just uh, put these pants on." ~Homestar

I'm for same sex marriages because it's a free country, my mom has tons of gay/bi friends, and my cousin is bi.
See also The American Constitution

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The Incoherology Trilogy

Check out my tale, and I promise to start posting again.

What was it.. life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?

Liberty and justice for all?

One can always hope.. I guess you could say that being gay is an acquired state. But you could also say that being black or Asian is an acquired state!! I personally think that homosexuality is a genetic trait. Oftentimes, a gay person will be the youngest sibling in his family-- usually will have an uncle/grandparent/great-grandparent/etc who is gay.

The main reason why certain people don't want to allow gay marriages is because then it gives gay people certain economic rights that they can't get when they are simply permanently dating. But that is bunk. Gay couples can raise kids (by insemination or adoption), and their marriages last at least as long as straight marriages, statistically speaking.

And if you don't want to allow gay marriages strictly based on the "they can't have kids" argument, then you should also not allow sterile people to marry.. nor should you allow couples who marry just for the benefits or to get greencards, etc (and believe me, that happens a lot.. I know a woman who married a foriegn gay guy to get him his greencard, and so that she could get healthcare, and they both currently date other guys while being married to each other--).

My biggest problem is that if someone wants to change the constitution to disallow gay marriages, then what's the next step? They could change it for anything! The constitution becomes useless and loses its powers. And that would be bad.

So there we have it.. my take on the situation.

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Hot!

Um, yeah, you need to go back to middle school and get your historical documents straight.



I rather doubt you've done any research on this, but others certainly have. Biologists have yet to find a genetic cause for homosexuality or any evidence that it's "passed on" genetically. Of course, it hasn't been disproven, either, but this is one of the reasons people (who haven't actually spoken to any homosexual people about it) cite as "proof" that homosexuality is a "choice". Unfortunately, it's all but impossible to find reliable data on this (if you go Google it, 80% of the "studies" you find have been sponsored by religious groups and hate groups).



Just so you know, that is illegal. But you're right about the rest.



This is my sentiment exactly. Some people want to amend the constitution to favor their beliefs and marginalize and entire section of the population. But haven't they considered the possibility that the next time around, they might be part of the section of the populace that gets marginalized?

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I wanted to talk about this a little more. I have no idea where your "youngest sibling" thing comes from. I've never heard anything of the sort, and in fact genetically it's impossible (every child of the same parents has the same chance of inheriting the same genes, no matter how many children precede them).

Anyway, I have something to add concerning the gay relative part. Every person who has an extended family of any appreciable size (that is, assuming your parents don't both have recent ancestors with predominantly zero, one, or two children) is fairly likely to have a gay member. Though I don't have any data on it, the reason you have this perception that gay people are born to families with other gay people is very likely this: a gay person is far, far more likely to come out if he knows that his family is accepting toward homosexuals. And so if a gay person sees that there's already one person in the family who is gay and out, then he will be far more likely to come out, and it might seem to you that, proportionally, that family has a lot of gay people. But if he sees no people in his family who are gay and out, and he doesn't know if his family will be accepting, he very likely may not come out, and it might seem to you like that family has no gay people.

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You have intriguing comments that completely make sense. I unfortunately haven't done a lot of research on the topic.. but I have noticed that it's true for most of my gay friends--except in this one family, where BOTH of the kids are gay. I also find it funny that in my family, it goes "girl, boy, girl, boy.. soce!" So go figure.

I realize that the longer I make this post, the more wild and speculative it's bound to get--and I may end up disagreeing with earlier statements that I made. But in terms of family dynamic, it often seems that the oldest is always the firmest, becoming the role model and always standing strong. As you get younger, you have to compete more and more for attention, and you are surrounded by all these big people who have already done so much.. the younger kids get more and more zany.. and then the youngest have less inhibitions, and they are free to live whatever life they want.

But my thoughts on the matter are all crazy.. I feel that someone can do things with one person and then do things with another later in life, and that doesn't even necessarily make them officially gay or straight. Like he could find men attractive or even recognise which men are attractive and which men aren't, but never want to get with other men. Or find certain men attractive but also find certain women attractive. I think the world was better 100s of years before, when people just did what they wanted without being labelled as being "gay" or "straight".

ok, i just went all over the place there :20x6:

!soce!

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Hot!

Well this, I feel, is pretty much unrelated to the homosexuality issue. There's a lot of debate in the psychology field about what impact birth order (and exactly some of the issues you mention) has on personality, but most researchers agree that homosexuality goes far, far deeper than personality, right down to a biological level. But this is where my knowledge of the research falls short, and Wikipedia isn't helping out much, either.



There's a popular contemporary theory that nobody is straight or gay, but that everybody falls somewhere on a bisexual spectrum. This seems fairly plausible to me. If you make attraction a spectrum and put "opposite sex" on one end (say the left) and "same sex" on the other (the right), most people fall in the left 10%, but almost nobody, I'd guess (and once again my data is lacking, here) falls in the left 0.0001%. Everybody, if they're not too afraid of their own sexuality, can appreciate the attractiveness of someone of the same sex. I mean, how many straight guys can honestly say that they don't find Orlando Bloom the least bit attractive? And even I (I figure I fall on or around the 10% or 15% line) wouldn't mind having a poke at Brad Pitt's abs. Anyway, we're definitely venturing into the realm of TMI, here, so I'll wrap this up. There's a good, short editorial about homophobia and the bisexual spectrum by Dan Savage. I'd link to it, but Dan Savage's column (though very informative), is extremely inappropriate for this site. Think about Googling it if you're 18+.

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